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Posted by Tommye on October 17, 1996 at 22:47:39:
Just reading all of the "Daggy" comments and was rather taken aback to see a put down--"almost makes you want to try the Republican way."
Can we be nice? Honestly, I am sure there are ALL kinds who like P&P2, even us Republican types.
Follow Ups:
Posted by Donna on October 17, 1996 at 22:55:44:
: : . . . Gregory Peck in most things (To Kill a Mockingbird may be my favorite movie of all time)
: : Amy
: I haven't been able to get to this BB in quite a while now, but this evening I managed to get on, and what do I find but a thread that includes Gregory Peck. At one point in my life I thought I'd gone beyond crushes, but then I saw Gregory Peck in Roman Holiday and felt my stomach go flip flop once again and realized that I was wrong. (There may be a point at which one gets beyond crushes, but I had not, and have not, yet reached it if there is.) Gregory Peck was so incredibly good looking, it was amazing to me. He is truly a man of whom it can be said that he was beautiful.
: ___________________
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There is something in Gregory Pecks voice the deepness of tone. I think Colin Firth has this too so does I don't know if you know of John Philip Law he as a tone of voice. Their voices are very appealing.
ciao Donna
Posted by Donna on October 17, 1996 at 23:43:32:
: : : Amy:
: : : Here's how I do it. Find the web page that has a picture you want to include at the top of your message.
: : : Find the entire URL for the graphic with a .gif or .jpg extension. Sometimes you can click on the picture and it will load all by itself in your browser window.
: :
: : ___________________
: : For Netscape users, if you hold your mouse button down on a graphic, you will get a pop-up menu, and one of the choices will be "Copy this image location" - choose it, and you will have the URL on your clipboard.
: : Joan, too
:
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: On IBM machines or clones, that is the *right* mouse button.
: Ann
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Thanks everyone for all the help
Donna
Posted by Janet on October 18, 1996 at 01:42:57:
: : : : : Don't you think they could have dressed Bingley and Darcy a little bit better for their own weddings?!
: : :
: : : ___________________
: : : I thought Darcy looked a bit somber at the ceremony.
: : : Afterwards of course there was that wonderful beaming smile,
: : : but he didn't look like he enjoyed the wedding itselff very
: : : much.
: : : Ann
: :
: : ___________________
: : Yes, I thought Darcy's attire looked particularly daggy (this is an Australianism with various, often affectionate, meanings; in this case it means lacking in style) in the church, though outside it looks okay. I keep on wanting to make the waistcoat longer. He does look sombre, but then he's a sombre bloke, who has a feeling for duty, occassion, ceremony, passages of life and all that. I can empathise with not enjoying the ceremony, too. Another bit of evidence for the case of shyness!
: : The other thing that bothers me about this scene is Lizzie's make-up. It looks much too heavy, and there's something about her that reminds me of Mrs.B, which is a worry. Her make-up does seem heavier later in the series, after looking wonderful in Derbyshire. I also prefer her in the cream/white/lightblue/grey dresses than in that 'curry' outfit that someone in 'The Making of P&P' thought she looked best in.
: : Hilary
: I didn't like this ending as well as PP1. I couldn't help but wish Darcy and Elzabeth had at least hugged, or taken his arm as in PP1. Elizabeth had dark circles under her eyes which could have been better dealt with.
: Why couldn't they have kept to the ending of the book - at least we see Darcy and Elizabeth married and living at Pemberly - after watching the video for 5 hours, another 15 minutes wouldn't have mattered!!
: Rose
:
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I agree that I would have liked to see the story wrapped up a bit more as in the book, especially after so much tension and misunderstanding throughout Darcy and Elizabeth's relationship. The conclusion in the book explains and resolves some of their misperceptions. I would have enjoyed hearing Darcy's acknowledgement from the book concerning how, at the time of his first proposal, he did not know how to please a woman which he was forced to learn in order to deserve Elizabeth. How much he had to learn...
Posted by Janet on October 18, 1996 at 03:06:51:
: :
: : : I disagree. I think that Mr. Collins has absolutely no idea of exactly how obnoxious he is, let alone how much Mary is like him. He may look down on Mary, but she isn't so harsh on him (she defends his consolation visit, upon Lydia's elopement, when everyone else is ready to toss him out of the house). It's probable that Mr. COllins, as self-righteous as he is, would be very flattered by Mary's analysis of his intents, and soften towards her. THis is not to say that a marriage between them would be happy, though I'm sure they would be able to moralise it to a state of satisfaction for both - the noble clergyman and his worthy philosopher-wife working together to save men's souls.
: : : As far as "good society," they'll always have Lady Catherine. That's always been good enough for Mr. COllins.
: : : - K
: :
: : ___________________
: : Kali, perhaps you are right. Mary probably has a soft heart under that austere facade. Perhaps the obnoxious Mr Collins in his angst brings out Mary's softer side.
: : Being such an obnoxious person, I think Mr Collins suddenly has a realisation of how much a hypocrite he is when he meets Mary - or is it that her piety matches his?
: : And Mr Collins is good enough for Lady C?
:
: ___________________
:
: I wonder how well Mr. Collins knows himself. Maybe more than I'm willing to allow him, but certainly not much (he is obviously "not a sensible man"). I still don't think that Mr. Collins consciously associates himself with Mary's master-of-the-obvious school of philosophy - he thinks too highly of himself. No doubt, as he thinks himself the superior moralizer in any situation, any similarities between them would either go unnoticed or unappreciated by Mr. C (ouch - passive voice -BAD!). Perhaps you have something there with the "piety-matching" thing - do you think that he may feel threatened, as small a man as he is?. If anyone has the film handy, they might want to observe more closely any reactions he may have to Mary prior to the scene of his "consolation visit."
: As far as Mary herself, I don't think she's austere - just dull and bookish and not very creative. She probably identifies with Mr. Collins. After all, she is the only Bennet who defends the pompous "olive branch" letter in which he announces his visit. I guess she tunes right in to his level of philosophical insipidity.
: And as far as Lady Catherine is concerned, Mr. COllins is somewhat of a servant, and a very willing subject of her condescention, which makes him fine by her. She may not like him, but she enjoys his flattery and dependence.
: Beginning to sound a lot like Mary Bennet,
: K
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In the contest of whom is more proud than whom, Mr. Collins may just be the victor. He does not pride himself on any of his own virtues or accomplishments, but merely on the basis of his association with Lady Catherine which exists simply because his purpose in life is to be her sychophant. Each time he meets various characters, his first comments refer to Lady C., as with Mrs. Philips, the Bingley sisters and Darcy at Netherfield, everyone he meets. We have probably all known people who boast of their connections or those they know, name-dropping in the hope of increasing their own value, but he plays it to the hilt. Not even the proudest on Darcy's side - Lady C. herself or the Bingley sisters - resort to this exercise. False pride is represented in a variety of ways by many others as well, including Mary, Sir Lucas, etc. However, Darcy and Elizabeth seem to be the only ones who learn to overcome it. Of course, Jane and Bingley do not possess false pride and so have not much to resolve, except interference on the part of others whom they allow to dissuade them from each other.
_________
Follow Ups:
Posted by Amy on October 18, 1996 at 04:18:48:
For anyone in danger of taking political campaigns too seriously (or for Tim Robbins fans), check out Bob Roberts, a 1992 movie starring and written and directed by Robbins. Bob is a rebel conservative folk singer/Wall Street mogul.
There's actually an Austen adaptation tie to this. Alan Rickman's in it as part of an incredible cast of all-star cameos -- just the way Robbins' mentor Robert Altman likes to do.
Amy
Link:
Posted by Ian on October 18, 1996 at 05:03:05:
: Just reading all of the "Daggy" comments and was rather taken aback to see a put down--"almost makes you want to try the Republican way."
: Can we be nice? Honestly, I am sure there are ALL kinds who like P&P2, even us Republican types.
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G'day All,
Being an Aussie the only types of Republicans are those who'd like to see the ditching of QE2 for a President, along with reform of The Constitution.
But getting back to P&P2. If Darcy was at all interested in politics would he have been a Whig or a Liberal? Come on some of you English people as you would all know better than I what he may have voted!
Posted by Eileen on October 18, 1996 at 11:05:43:
: : I find it interesting that before almost every meeting which tends to revise Lizzie's opinion of Darcy, or vice versa, Darcy is washing - at least, in P&P2. I do not, I confess, know if this is the case in the book.
: : There is one instance where this is not the case - the Lucas party at which he decides she has fine eyes and is more than merely tolerable.
: : But before he sees her playing with the dog, he's bathing. Before he hands her the letter, he's washing up. Before he meets her in the garden at Pemberly, he's swimming. The first one is where his own prejudice cracks. The second two signify the cracking of her prejudice, and the time when she suddenly, she desires his good opinion.
: : Why should these events be connected with water?
:
: ___________________
: I didn't originally notice the connection, but now that you mention it... I always thought that Darcy was about to commit suicide in the pond at Pemberley. In the book, however, there is no mention made of his swimming at all prior to his meeting with Elizabeth. I simply figured he didn't have the guts to go through with his suicide attempt after he dove in.
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* I must admit that scene was rather dramatic. I can see how you might have thought so. He did seem on the brink of despair, didn't he? And how his spirits change when he sees Elizabeth on the lawn! Still, my first instinct wasn't to think that he would commit suicide, but that perhaps it was an irrationality out of anguish. He needed some sort of diversion; I think a little cold water could divert anyone. In any case, I enjoyed Darcy's 'irrationality'. A friend was watching this with me one evening (she had never seen it before), and said that the scene might have been more effective if Darcy had removed his shirt. I was amused.
Posted by Mich on October 18, 1996 at 11:07:05:
: : : : We understand wanting wealth in the family but this woman is obsessed!
: : : Mrs. Bennet drives me nuts, too. I have very little time for her.
: : : But for another perspective, here are a few bits from Fay Weldon's book "Letters to Alice on first reading JA":
: : : Hilary
: :
: : ___________________
: :
: : Do you know what the average life span of man and woman was?
: : Just curious
: : Mich
:
: ___________________
: No, I don't, but I've always assumed about 40-45, much less than now. JA herself lived 1775 - 1817, whats that, 42 years.
: Hilary
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Very sad time to live in, especially for women.
Makes me quite thankful to be in 1996.
Mich
Posted by Mich on October 18, 1996 at 11:11:36:
: : : According to the Friends of Firth web site, Colin is
: : : currently in the US working on Jane Smiley's "Thousand Acres"
: : : (a modern interpretation of King Lear.)
: : : Ann
: :
: : ___________________
: : Would that be the one with Michelle Pfeiffer and Jessica Lange(?) ?
: : Ann2
:
: ___________________
: Yes. And Jason Robards.
: Ann
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Who will Colin fall in love with? I think both Michelle and Jessica are happily attached. This may be quite dull for him.
Mich
Posted by kathy on October 18, 1996 at 11:16:56:
: Why should these events be connected with water?
Perhaps it is to symbolize a sort of "baptism" so to speek as Pride is one of the seven deadly's. Kathy
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Posted by kathy on October 18, 1996 at 11:17:04:
: Why should these events be connected with water?
Perhaps it is to symbolize a sort of "baptism" so to speek as Pride is one of the seven deadly's. Kathy
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Posted by Eileen on October 18, 1996 at 11:17:10:
: : : Anybody like Liam Neeson? Hear anything about the new movie, "Michael Collins?"
: :
: : ___________________
: :
: : LOVE Neeson, thought he was fabulous in Schindler, Nell, Rob Roy and have been a fan since Suspect. He is not really handsome, but there is something very appealing and accomplished in his air altogether (had to get P&P2 in there somewhere!) I am looking forward to Michael Collins (there's that name again) and seeing how he makes the founder of modern urban terrorist tactics charismatic and likeable (which by all accounts I have read he has managed to do). I have heard that this movie is causing some tension in the UK. Can any of our English friends comment?
: : Cheryl
: : Amy, it is interesting how our taste in actors is so very similar. Next you'll be telling me that you also love Gary Cooper and Ralph Feinnes (two other actors I admire and people go "huh?")
: Have seen a preview of "Collins" and heard some good things about it. I would watch Liam Neeson read the phone book. Ralph Feinnes wouldn't even have to read.
: Mary H
:
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I definately agree with Mary H. about Feinnes. I thought he was an extraordinary Heathcliff in "Wuthering Heights". Has anyone seen this? It got a bad rap in the reviews. People still prefer the older versions. I think his performance blew Timothy Dalton's out of the water, though. And Juliette Binoche was a perfect Kathy, just like Jennifer Ehle was the perfect Lizzie, and last but not least, Colin Firth as Darcy.
Posted by kathy on October 18, 1996 at 11:21:22:
: : ___________________
: Please no nakedness, I beg you!
: ___________________
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Posted by kathy on October 18, 1996 at 11:29:29:
: I like the bit in the video, where Darcy sees Elizabeth outside the window at Netherfield playing with the dog, and even though she's not behaving in a ladylike way he is intrigued by, and drawn to her.
I think you can tell a lot about a person by how they are with children and animals when no one is looking. kathy
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Posted by Grace on October 18, 1996 at 11:50:58:
Anyone else having trouble envisioning Colin Firth in A Thousand Acres? I know he will pull it off admirably, but will we be able to stand it? Darcy, wearing a John Deere hat, at the hog roast? Worse still, Darcy in a pickup truck at the dump?
I can just see how this all came about....Michelle Pfeiffer and Jessica Lange watching P&P2 over and over and over.....calling each other in the middle of the night: We're producing this thousand acres thing, we can have Darcy in it if we want to......we'll tell people he picked up the accent in Canada.
Follow Ups:
Posted by Mary H on October 18, 1996 at 12:12:25:
: Mary dear, fabulous picture, thankyouthankyouthankyou!
: Cheryl
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You are most welcome. Glad to meet another Fiennes fan. I have to find his "Wuthering Heights" now. I think he'd be a perfect Heathcliff.
Mary H
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