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Posted by Amy on September 23, 1996 at 01:13:41:
: Sorry about my bad manners.I did not mean to shout
No, no. It is I who ought to apologise. I have been thinking more about making sport since I heard some public fun has been had at my expense.
and I certainly
: regret my error in quoting Darcy wrong (from memory)
Didn't notice.
"Firth fantasies"
: to cool(?) my mind!
: Ann2
Are you Swedish, Ann? Your English is perfect.
Amy
Follow Ups:
Posted by The Mysterious H.C. on September 23, 1996 at 01:35:41:
: : : Carolyn commented on the prettyish sort of wilderness scene:
: : : I also like this scene but what I really would like to see is Lady C's visit to Darcy afterwards.
I hate to differ, but I think this would be kind of boring: Lady Catherine would rant in much the same way as we have already seen her do at Elizabeth, while Darcy would be reserved - not wanting to offend, but non-committal
: One thing I like so much about this adaptation is that we get to see points of view other than Lizzy's. I wonder if any of the sequel writers ever considered doing a... I don't know what you'd call it, a version of the story that takes place during the same time period, but from another point of view.
: Like Little Dorrit, or the Hundred Dollar Misunderstanding, or Divorce His Divorce Hers. Leon Uris did something like this with Redemption, part of which took place during the same time period as Trinity.
Are you thinking of Rashomon? The Little Dorrit book is one of my favorite novels, but I haven't seen the movie all the way through because my University's videotape fades out.
: O Henry, are you still behind that screen? I know you have analyzed or at least reported on male-only dialogs in Austen. I wonder if anyone has ever looked in to a number or share of scenes sans the heroine?
Not really, but some examples that spring to mind are the conversations between Darcy and Miss Bingley, between Mrs. Weston and Miss Taylor, and between Sir Thomas and Mrs. Norris at the beginning of Mansfield Park.
Of course, a male-male male conversation, with no women present or overhearing, is also one at which the heroine is not present.
Link:
Follow Ups:
Posted by Amy on September 23, 1996 at 08:21:27:
: I would really like to help you - but you would be dealing with a REAL novice - i am very interested in learning if you want to teach!!!
We're covered this time around. Joan too jumped in and finished all the tables. Now I just have to stick them together. I hope you are still as willing to help next time something comes up, Sarah. Thanks.
Amy
Posted by Ann on September 23, 1996 at 09:15:47:
: I learned only today that the Firthlisters have been trashing us, or me or this board or something. I don't read the digests everyday and missed the damning posts. Anna-Karin or Laura, pray write and tell the nature of this slander for I am quite astonished to hear of it.
: Are we too uneducated in Firthlore? Too prissy? I don't understand. I have always enjoyed reading the posts there and have delighted in the difference from this place in style, tone, character. Hurts my feelings a little. Please tell so I won't imagine worse.
: Amy
:
That's a great picture! Where does it come from?
Ann
Follow Ups:
Posted by Ann on September 23, 1996 at 09:23:16:
:
: : : Carolyn commented on the prettyish sort of wilderness scene:
: : : : I also like this scene but what I really would like to see is Lady C's visit to Darcy afterwards.
I hate to differ, but I think this would be kind of boring: Lady Catherine would rant in much the same way as we have already seen her do at Elizabeth, while Darcy would be reserved - not wanting to offend, but non-committal
:
: One thing I like so much about this adaptation is that we get to see points of view other than Lizzy's. I wonder if any of the sequel writers ever considered doing a... I don't know what you'd call it, a version of the story that takes place during the same time period, but from another point of view.
: : Like Little Dorrit, or the Hundred Dollar Misunderstanding, or Divorce His Divorce Hers. Leon Uris did something like this with Redemption, part of which took place during the same time period as Trinity.
Are you thinking of Rashomon? The Little Dorrit book is one of my favorite novels, but I haven't seen the movie all the way through because my University's videotape fades out.
:
: O Henry, are you still behind that screen? I know you have analyzed or at least reported on male-only dialogs in Austen. I wonder if anyone has ever looked in to a number or share of scenes sans the heroine?
Not really, but some examples that spring to mind are the conversations between Darcy and Miss Bingley, between Mrs. Weston and Miss Taylor, and between Sir Thomas and Mrs. Norris at the beginning of Mansfield Park.
: Of course, a male-male male conversation, with no women present or overhearing, is also one at which the heroine is not present.
I thought Mrs. Weston is Miss Taylor???
Ann
Follow Ups:
Posted by Ann(1) on September 23, 1996 at 09:30:22:
: : Sorry about my bad manners.I did not mean to shout
I too am sorry if my remarks may have offended you. I was
just teasing.
Ann(1)
Follow Ups:
Posted by Natalie on September 23, 1996 at 09:54:46:
: I thought some wrote that they wanted to buy Persuasion.
: I bought it for $20.99. I know it is for rent but it isn't
: for sale yet.
I posted this once before but Persuasion is going to be on PBS this season
Natalie
Follow Ups:
Posted by Natalie on September 23, 1996 at 10:02:12:
: PH asked:: Please tell me what you thought of The Advocate. I couldn't
: : get past the video cover. It looked a little too racy for
: : me. Thanx
: I was so disappointed. I found the sex gratuitous. Maybe that's what poeple did all the time in the middle ages. If you see the Virgin Spring or hte Name of the Rose, that's what you would be inclined to believe.
: I like late middle age and renaissance stuff. I wish something good would come out.
: Amy
I loved the Advocate. I thought it was great how they showed the hypocricy of the legal system as well as the
people sworn to uphold it - parallels todays system. The gratuitous sex was ok I mean he was living in a brothel
at the time. I also liked the way the show the prejudices and supersticions of the
people at the period. Great film - I think it his best outside of P&P and Another Country
Natalie
Follow Ups:
Posted by Ann2 on September 23, 1996 at 10:44:43:
: : : Sorry about my bad manners.I did not mean to shout
:
: I too am sorry if my remarks may have offended you. I was
: just teasing.
: Ann(1)
No my dear name-mate(or whatever itīs called in english), I
am not that easily offended. I enjoy a good tease! And although
I often feel a bit Darcy* when people don`t behave as they ought
to, (no breeding at all!) in this case our mutual interest is
sure to make me forgive any small rudenesses from you.Thanks
to both you and Amy for your messages. They certainly make me
at home!
Ann2
* (my daughter and I use this expression when the circumstances
are somewhat vulgar or "Mr Darcy is not amused")
Posted by Donna on September 23, 1996 at 10:59:50:
: : I thought some wrote that they wanted to buy Persuasion.
: : I bought it for $20.99. I know it is for rent but it isn't
: : for sale yet.
: I posted this once before but Persuasion is going to be on PBS this season
: Natalie
Yes, I know thanks anyway. I just thought someone wanted to buy the movie.
I bought it before I knew it would be on PBS. That's why I posted that address and
phone number to buy the original tape. It does cost mush less to record it.
Donna
Follow Ups:
Posted by Donna on September 23, 1996 at 11:02:44:
: : Call Northside 777 can't remember this one. I know I've seen most of them
: : Rear Window, Vertigo,The Man Who Knew Too Much, and even the westerns Cheyenne
: : Social with Henry Fonda and I love Harvey. I have a movie triva list book but its an old version
: : 1984-85 it doesn't give enough information about Call Northside 777.Henry Fonda excellent,Carey Grant to
: : name a few. To Kill a Mockingbird love this one. Great movie I could see Colin doing this part
: : Atticus don't think I spelled the name right. This was one of the most perfect movies. I sure someone
: : will want to remake this someday. "I love old movies" I could go on and on and on. So I will cast my
: : vote due to avaiablity Enchanted April.
: : Donna
: You may wish to look it up at the Internet Movie Database. I'm
: sure they have information on it. Look up "James Stewart" and
: go from there. Released in 1948, I believe. Excellent drama,
: hardly constrained by the pushy patriotism of the day. It shows
: the justice system and police corruption through the eyes of a
: very cynical news reporter (Stewart) who gets interested despite
: himself about a mother who's advertising in the paper to pay
: thousands of dollars as a reward for any information leading to
: the proof that her son, serving twenty+ in jail, is wrongly
: accused, which he is (whew! complicated). Wonderful growth of
: Stewart's character and some truly marvelous acting. I would
: urge you very much to rent it, especially if you're a fan of his.
: Cordially,
: Raphael
Thanks, I will rent that. He has done more T.V. series than I realized.
Donna
Posted by Annie on September 23, 1996 at 11:20:40:
: Here are the bio questions developed by Ramona that some of us answered 10 days ago or so. If any of the new people here would like to tell about themselves, please do. If not, okay too. I'll try to get the answers from the others in shape sometime over the weekend.
: Amy
: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
: 1) Name-
: 2) Occupation-
: 3) When you first saw P&P2-
: 4) How did you find out about it?
: 5) What interested you in seeing it?
: 6) Have you read the original novel?
: 7) If so, before or after seeing the movie?
: 8) Favorite character(s) (other than Lizzy or Darcy-as liking them goes without saying.)
: 9) Favorite scene/sequence
: 10) Most awkward scene to watch (or not watch because you feel so embarrassed for the characters involved)-
: 11) Other Austen films viewed-
: 12) Anything else you would like to share (interests, marital status etc...)-
: 1. My name is Annie.
2. I'm a full-time student (English and Psychology).
3. The first time I saw P&P2 was the first time it aired back in January. I have seen it every time it has been on since.
4. I kept seeing the ads, so I watched it. Plus, I had a professor who kept telling the class it would be on.
5. I was interested in seeing the movie because I had just finished the book. Also, at the time I was taking a women authors in literature class, and Jane Austen was one of the authors we were studying.
6 & 7. I have read the book several times, before and after the movie.
8. My favorite character (other than the totally obvious) has to be Mr. Bennet.
9. My favorite scene is where Elizabeth and Darcy get married.
10. The most awkward scene for me to watch is when Lydia and Wickham return to Longbourn after they are married. Lydia acts like such a brat when she says to Jane, "You must go lower because I'm a married woman."
11. I have seen "Persuasion" (twice--and I'm beginning to like Captain Wentworth a lot better, but still not as much as Mr. Darcy), Sense and Sensibility, and the other two versions of Pride and Prejudice.
12. I am unmarried, dating, almost 21, and I love to read and write.
Posted by ann2 on September 23, 1996 at 11:30:09:
:
: : Actually, in the book Lizzie (chapter 6) did play and sing in front of Darcy, although we are not told what Darcy's reaction is.
: This was at Sir William Lucas' party, shortly before Lizzie refused to dance with Darcy.
: : : : : : Sarah
: : : : : : I can't remember if we have talked about this before - when did Darcy ever hear Lizzie play and sing prior to the mini concert at Rosings? Col Fitzwilliam greets her at their first meeting at the Collins with "I understand you sing AND play" - how did he know? Was it just heresay like when Caroline "duck face" Bingley tells Darcy in the scene after dinner at Pemberly something about how they had heard of Lizzie's beauty before they arrived.
: : :
: : : : : Amy
: : : : : Many more meetings between the Bingleys/Darcy and the Bennets were either described or implied in the book. At least one dinner, for example, was not shown, but was obliquely referred to when Lizzie told Jane she bet Bingley would be back and dining at Longbourn within a fortnight.
: : : : Johanna
: : : : No, that dinner was speculation on Elizabeth's part, assuming Bingley's love for Jane would overcome any machinations that his sisters may have to break off his attentions. So, there was nothing in the book (or show) left out, because that dinner never, in fact took place, Jane received further news that the Bingleys would stay on in London with no plans to return, thus curtailing the dinner Elizabeth had anticipated. I really can't recall any circumstance in which Darcy would have heard Elizabeth play prior to Rosings.
: : : The time it would most likely have taken place would have been while Jane was sick at Netherfield - in the book they stay several more days than in the film and Lizzie endurees several more uncomfortable evenings in the society of Darcy and the Bingley sisters, but it could have been just hearsay, too, since someone ("duck face" after raving about Georgiana's accomplishments?) did ask her whether she played and sang, and she replied that she did, but very ill.
: : : But the film's script and/or continuity person appear to have been confused about this, too, since after Lizzie and the Gardiners leave Pemberly following the scene in which Lizzie does sing and play, Caroline carries on criticising Lizzie at length and says (incorrectly) that she does recall Darcy "one evening after they's been dining at Netherfield, saying 'She a beauty? I'd as soon call her mother a wit'". Well, that conversation actually took place after they had attended the Assembly in Meryton, not after they had dined at Netherfield, so it appears that there is some impression that they had had the Bennets to dinner at some time, and that the Bennets had plans to reciprocate when the Netherfield party suddenly left for London.
: : : Joan, too
Yes, chapter 6 and it is said that Lizzie, easy and unaffected,
had been listened to with much more pleasure, though not playing
half so well(compared to poor Mary who has neither genius nor
taste. And it is Charlotte who makes Lizzie perform and Darcy
is in their company at that moment.
Ann2
Posted by Mary on September 23, 1996 at 11:35:45:
: : Next virtual viewing nominations. Vote by Tuesday. We will begin discussion on Sunday 9/29.
: :
Posted by James Berg on September 23, 1996 at 12:10:54:
: Has anyone noticed that the story which Judi Dench's character
: tells Charlotte when they are out on the picnic seems to be the
: story-line from Forster's "Where Angels Fear To Tread"?
: Does any one know whether that is in the text of RWAV, or did the
: screen writer use Where Angels Fear To Tread to enhance the scene?
: Ann
The dialogue is invented by Ruth Prawer Jhabvala for the film, and it
is indeed the story of Lilia in Where Angels Fear to Tread, although
slightly amended. Miss Lavish asks "did she never go back to Weybridge?"
when in fact Lilia came from Sawston and Forster himself lived in
Weybridge at the time he wrote Angels and Room.
I'm new to this site and am responding to Amy Bellinger's post on
the Modern British list for a Forster person. I just finished
a dissertation on the Forster adaptations, but I haven't seen the
BBC/A&E Pride and Prejudice (no cable).
James Berg
University of Minnesota
Follow Ups:
Posted by Tommye on September 23, 1996 at 12:14:05:
: : : I thought some wrote that they wanted to buy Persuasion.
: : : I bought it for $20.99. I know it is for rent but it isn't
: : : for sale yet.
: : I posted this once before but Persuasion is going to be on PBS this season
: : Natalie
.
I would like to buy Persuasion! Where did you get it for $20.99?? I was told that Sense and Sensibility was $99, and it, too, was released this past year. How could someone sell Persuasion so cheaply? Anyway, I want it!
Tommye
Follow Ups:
Posted by kathy on September 23, 1996 at 12:17:45:
: Here are the bio questions developed by Ramona that some of us answered 10 days ago or so. If any of the new people here would like to tell about themselves, please do. If not, okay too. I'll try to get the answers from the others in shape sometime over the weekend.
: Amy
: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
: 1) Name-
:Kathy from Fl. 2) Occupation-
:Medicalish 3) When you first saw P&P2-
:1/96 4) How did you find out about it?
:My husband the dear. He has been so good about this Firth/Austen thing. He goes to the movies with me. He was even scolded by a rabid fan for swinging his foot in the aisle. I didn't understand it at the time. 5) What interested you in seeing it?
: Used to have a crush on Hugh Grant, (sorry Hugh). 6) Have you read the original novel?
:yes, had a hard time with Austen at first. 7) If so, before or after seeing the movie?
:both 8) Favorite character(s) (other than Lizzy or Darcy-as liking them goes without saying.)
:Charlotte is sooo practical. Mr. Bennett. Laddy Catherine is sooo obnoxious and Bingley is so innocent and nice. 9) Favorite scene/sequence
:All scenes with Lizzy and Darcy and Darcy wrestling with rejection and unrequited love (sword and letter scen1es). 10) Most awkward scene to watch (or not watch because you feel so embarrassed for the characters involved)-
:Lizzy at Pemberly, Lydia for herself, the Collin's for having to suck-up to Lady Catherine all the time. 11) Other Austen films viewed-
: P&P with Larry, P&P with the "wooden" Darcy, Persuasion with the tacky video cover, Emma, Clueless, Northanger Abbey S&S. 12) Anything else you would like to share (interests, marital status etc...)-
Like movies where the lovers don't have to sleep together for it to be interesting. Like Catherine Cookson. Like this board, check it every day if I'm home.
Posted by kathy on September 23, 1996 at 12:17:51:
: Here are the bio questions developed by Ramona that some of us answered 10 days ago or so. If any of the new people here would like to tell about themselves, please do. If not, okay too. I'll try to get the answers from the others in shape sometime over the weekend.
: Amy
: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
: 1) Name-
:Kathy from Fl. 2) Occupation-
:Medicalish 3) When you first saw P&P2-
:1/96 4) How did you find out about it?
:My husband the dear. He has been so good about this Firth/Austen thing. He goes to the movies with me. He was even scolded by a rabid fan for swinging his foot in the aisle. I didn't understand it at the time. 5) What interested you in seeing it?
: Used to have a crush on Hugh Grant, (sorry Hugh). 6) Have you read the original novel?
:yes, had a hard time with Austen at first. 7) If so, before or after seeing the movie?
:both 8) Favorite character(s) (other than Lizzy or Darcy-as liking them goes without saying.)
:Charlotte is sooo practical. Mr. Bennett. Laddy Catherine is sooo obnoxious and Bingley is so innocent and nice. 9) Favorite scene/sequence
:All scenes with Lizzy and Darcy and Darcy wrestling with rejection and unrequited love (sword and letter scen1es). 10) Most awkward scene to watch (or not watch because you feel so embarrassed for the characters involved)-
:Lizzy at Pemberly, Lydia for herself, the Collin's for having to suck-up to Lady Catherine all the time. 11) Other Austen films viewed-
: P&P with Larry, P&P with the "wooden" Darcy, Persuasion with the tacky video cover, Emma, Clueless, Northanger Abbey S&S. 12) Anything else you would like to share (interests, marital status etc...)-
Like movies where the lovers don't have to sleep together for it to be interesting. Like Catherine Cookson. Like this board, check it every day if I'm home.
Posted by Mary on September 23, 1996 at 12:25:51:
: Here are the bio questions developed by Ramona that some of us answered 10 days ago or so. If any of the new people here would like to tell about themselves, please do. If not, okay too. I'll try to get the answers from the others in shape sometime over the weekend.
: Amy
: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
: 1) Name-
Mary Hestand
: 2) Occupation-
I'm an assistant to the 1985 winners of the Nobel Prize for
Physiology or Medicine
: 3) When you first saw P&P2-
In May or June of 1996
: 4) How did you find out about it?
A friend of mine at work had a tape of the first broadcast.
She is obviously not an addict, as I still have her tape! I
keep offering (reluctantly) to bring it back, but she says
she doesn't think she'll watch it again. Can you imagine?
(I must be the only person in the world without cable.)
: 5) What interested you in seeing it?
I loved the book and had already seen "Persuasion" and loved
it.
: 6) Have you read the original novel?
Yes!
: 7) If so, before or after seeing the movie?
Before. I read it when I was a teenager a couple of times.
I'm about to start it again, but I've been reading all the
other published novels (including the unfinished ones) and the
juvenalia off the web.
: 8) Favorite character(s) (other than Lizzy or Darcy-as liking them goes without saying.)
Caroline Bingley, Mrs. Bennet, and Mr. Collins. Now granted,
I wouldn't want to actually spend any time with any of these
characters, but they are so hilarious to watch that I can't
help feeling a perverse affection for them. I just love the
way that smile freezes on Miss Bingley's face everytime Darcy
says something nice about Lizzy. And the way Mrs. Bennet
squeals when she's happy or upset. And the way Mr. Collins
waves his hand to the music in the Netherfield Ball scene.
: 9) Favorite scene/sequence
O.K., I've already admitted to being perverse. I love the
first ball where Bingley suggests that Darcy dance with Lizzy
and she overhears him say that "She is tolerable enough, but
not handsome enough to tempt me." I love the look of shock
on Lizzy's face when she hears him and then how she immediately
recovers and goes over to laugh with Charlotte Lucas about it.
It shows her character so perfectly. And Darcy looks so
uncomfortable watching her with Charlotte. You know he thinks
she is laughing at him for what he said.
: 10) Most awkward scene to watch (or not watch because you feel so embarrassed for the characters involved)-
Since I love even the awkward scenes, that's hard to say. I
suppose it would be the scene where Jane goes to see Miss
Bingley in London. Poor Jane is so hurt by Miss Bingley's
coldness and she's already suffering so much, I hate to see
her have to endure more.
: 11) Other Austen films viewed-
Persuasion, S&S and Emma.
: 12) Anything else you would like to share (interests, marital status etc...)-
I'm a filmmaker in my "spare time." I'm currently editing
my latest short film, which will be aired on a local cable
station if I ever get it finished. (The station is the Irving
Community Television Network, for those of you who get Paragon
cable in Irving, Texas!) I would love to direct a "period piece,"
(I have written one set in the Depression era) but can't find
enough funding to shoot it.
I'm married and have two daughters, ages 4 and 6.
Posted by Mary on September 23, 1996 at 12:25:56:
: Here are the bio questions developed by Ramona that some of us answered 10 days ago or so. If any of the new people here would like to tell about themselves, please do. If not, okay too. I'll try to get the answers from the others in shape sometime over the weekend.
: Amy
: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
: 1) Name-
Mary Hestand
: 2) Occupation-
I'm an assistant to the 1985 winners of the Nobel Prize for
Physiology or Medicine
: 3) When you first saw P&P2-
In May or June of 1996
: 4) How did you find out about it?
A friend of mine at work had a tape of the first broadcast.
She is obviously not an addict, as I still have her tape! I
keep offering (reluctantly) to bring it back, but she says
she doesn't think she'll watch it again. Can you imagine?
(I must be the only person in the world without cable.)
: 5) What interested you in seeing it?
I loved the book and had already seen "Persuasion" and loved
it.
: 6) Have you read the original novel?
Yes!
: 7) If so, before or after seeing the movie?
Before. I read it when I was a teenager a couple of times.
I'm about to start it again, but I've been reading all the
other published novels (including the unfinished ones) and the
juvenalia off the web.
: 8) Favorite character(s) (other than Lizzy or Darcy-as liking them goes without saying.)
Caroline Bingley, Mrs. Bennet, and Mr. Collins. Now granted,
I wouldn't want to actually spend any time with any of these
characters, but they are so hilarious to watch that I can't
help feeling a perverse affection for them. I just love the
way that smile freezes on Miss Bingley's face everytime Darcy
says something nice about Lizzy. And the way Mrs. Bennet
squeals when she's happy or upset. And the way Mr. Collins
waves his hand to the music in the Netherfield Ball scene.
: 9) Favorite scene/sequence
O.K., I've already admitted to being perverse. I love the
first ball where Bingley suggests that Darcy dance with Lizzy
and she overhears him say that "She is tolerable enough, but
not handsome enough to tempt me." I love the look of shock
on Lizzy's face when she hears him and then how she immediately
recovers and goes over to laugh with Charlotte Lucas about it.
It shows her character so perfectly. And Darcy looks so
uncomfortable watching her with Charlotte. You know he thinks
she is laughing at him for what he said.
: 10) Most awkward scene to watch (or not watch because you feel so embarrassed for the characters involved)-
Since I love even the awkward scenes, that's hard to say. I
suppose it would be the scene where Jane goes to see Miss
Bingley in London. Poor Jane is so hurt by Miss Bingley's
coldness and she's already suffering so much, I hate to see
her have to endure more.
: 11) Other Austen films viewed-
Persuasion, S&S and Emma.
: 12) Anything else you would like to share (interests, marital status etc...)-
I'm a filmmaker in my "spare time." I'm currently editing
my latest short film, which will be aired on a local cable
station if I ever get it finished. (The station is the Irving
Community Television Network, for those of you who get Paragon
cable in Irving, Texas!) I would love to direct a "period piece,"
(I have written one set in the Depression era) but can't find
enough funding to shoot it.
I'm married and have two daughters, ages 4 and 6.
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