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Posted by Amy on September 16, 1996 at 11:55:14:
Laura asked:
>>: Could someone explain to me the scene in the plaza in Florence when the guy is stabbed. Did I miss something or was it a show put on by the natives. I know stupid question.
I always figured it for real violence. But now you make me wonder.
No wait. To what end would it be fake? It wouldn't serve the story, would it? From what George says at the bridge, I think we can gather the riot is a chance thing and chance things can put a crook or a turn in one's life's path?
Anybody else have a take?
Amy
Follow Ups:
Posted by Laura on September 16, 1996 at 11:55:42:
: Are we ready to start? Maybe to ease into it, we could first tell about our experience with the film: saw it before? read the book? read any Forster?
: Amy
Okay, I'll tell you when I first saw ARWAV. It was about 4 months ago. I have really been into the period English movies and was clamoring for something in which I could sink my teeth into. Well people mentioned ARWAV, and Rupert was in it. So I relented and rented. I absolutely fell in love with that whole genre. I do remember a couple of years back trying to watch "Howard's End" but I kept falling asleep. Anyway, I'm not a huge Julian Sands fan, he comes across as too Aryan for me. But I always admired Maggie Smith and Helena Bonham-Carter because she is so beautiful. I have not read the book. I think I'm intimidated by Forster. Hey I just finished all of Austen's novels I can only do one author at a time. Well I'm now up to Dickens. I have read Bronte. Well Forster is next then ABDF. Get it? so. That is my history of ARWAV. From there I have seen Where Angels Fear to Tread, Maurice (excellent), A Handful of Dust, Howard's End(finally stayed awake and loved it). I have yet to see A Passage
to India, then I believe I would have seen all the Forster Movies. Sorry long enough post. Laura
Follow Ups:
Posted by Laura on September 16, 1996 at 12:01:02:
:
: : Amy
: : Why were there such a slew of Catholic movies around then? Wasn't that about the time the Singing Nun came out. too? And The Trouble with Angels?
: I don't think it was just then. Seems as if there has been a steady trickle of them all along. Didn't Bing Crosby play enough priests to earn a free pass to heaven? And along the way there were those "Lilies of the Field" flicks and more recently Whoopi Goldberg's "Sister Acts". Not to mention all of the Biblical epics.
: Joan, too
FWIW, I love The Trouble with Angels, But Hayley Mills as a Nun, I never did believe that twist in the plot.
Laura
Posted by Lea on September 16, 1996 at 12:33:45:
Here is a quote from "Presumption: An Entertainment" by Julia Barrett that will say much to devoted readers/viewers of Austen:
"Her (Elizabeth's) miseries she kept well hidden. Darcy, she was determined, would see none of her tears. She would make her own way in his household and in his country, and if she wept she would do so alone."
As someone who has been constantly rereading Austen since discovering P&P ten years ago, I can't see Lizzie in her room crying.
But I still need to finish the book before I pass final judgement.
Lea
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Posted by Annie on September 16, 1996 at 13:11:36:
I don't think the fight in "A Room with a View" was staged.
Why else would Lucy faint? I guess she was squeamish about the
sight of blood, even possibly faked blood. I always figured that
the fight was real when I watched the movie.
Posted by Lorraine on September 16, 1996 at 13:57:21:
: ["I just love it when guys peel out." What movie is that from?]
:
: Amy
American Graffiti - Debbie to Terry the Toad
Lorraine
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Posted by Lorraine on September 16, 1996 at 14:01:57:
: Lorraine said:
: >>: I love to laugh at Mr. Collins - the line "he oiled his way across the floor" goes
: : through my mind while I watch him!
: Did he also ooze charm from every pour? And hwen at last the dance was done, did he glower as if he knew he'd won? And with a voice too eager and a smile too broad, did he announce to the hostess that she was a fraud?
Thanks, Amy! I wracked my brain, but couldn't remember
where that quote was from - now I remember - My Fair Lady!
Lorraine
Posted by Donna on September 16, 1996 at 14:09:55:
: Are we ready to start? Maybe to ease into it, we could first tell about our experience with the film: saw it before? read the book? read any Forster?
: Amy
I've seen Howard's End, Passage to India many moons ago.
Have never read either. Just bought Mary Shelley's Frankenstein and D.H. Lawrence
Rainbow. Have you read anyone of these. Read Lady's of the Club.
ARWAV I enjoyed it. It wasn't what I thought it would be.
It was different than Howards End. You wouldn't think it was
written by the same person. Based on the movies which I saw.
Donna
Posted by Laura on September 16, 1996 at 14:31:52:
: Laura asked:
: >>: Could someone explain to me the scene in the plaza in Florence when the guy is stabbed. Did I miss something or was it a show put on by the natives. I know stupid question.
:
: I always figured it for real violence. But now you make me wonder.
: No wait. To what end would it be fake? It wouldn't serve the story, would it? From what George says at the bridge, I think we can gather the riot is a chance thing and chance things can put a crook or a turn in one's life's path?
: Anybody else have a take?
: Amy
Well Amy, your graphics are graphic. Pun intended
Posted by Johanna on September 16, 1996 at 14:47:37:
: Here is a quote from "Presumption: An Entertainment" by Julia Barrett that will say much to devoted readers/viewers of Austen:
: "Her (Elizabeth's) miseries she kept well hidden. Darcy, she was determined, would see none of her tears. She would make her own way in his household and in his country, and if she wept she would do so alone."
: As someone who has been constantly rereading Austen since discovering P&P ten years ago, I can't see Lizzie in her room crying.
: But I still need to finish the book before I pass final judgement.
: Lea
Well, bummer. I hadn't imagined Lizzy and Darcy unhappy. She was to talk to him in a "lively, sportive manner." The implication being that they had fun. It sounds like a Gothic romance.
Oh well. I'll check out the library and try it - and _Pemberly_ - before I, too, pass final judgement.
Also, wanted to ask if anyone reads Anita Brookner? She has been compared favorably to Austen. "Latter day" etc, etc. I have enjoyed her work, although she is far from romantic, she does lay modern manners and society out for examination. The conflicts are internal and she frequently describes a discussion between two characters in the same removed fashion in which Austen does. It can be somewhat less than sanguine to read about the passion than to "hear" it spoken, but it makes way for the internal dialog that the charaters are having in there heads. So, Brookner, 20th century's, Austen, according to various reviews etc.
Johanna
Posted by Natalie on September 16, 1996 at 15:12:44:
: First of all thank you everyone for the response to the bio questions. I think we all are on much of the same wavelength.
: And now I am soliciting opinions regarding Persuasion (the recent film and the novel). The first time I saw the film I hadn't read the book yet and did not care much for it, because it seemed so bleak compared to P&P2. However I set to reading the novel, which gave me a better appreciation for the loveliness and depth of the story. And after that I viewed the film again and enjoyed it much more. It isn't very glamorous, but if anything seems more able to help us to relate to the people as they would be in that time period.
: I think something else that helped me warm up to the story was the high praise it has received from Jane Austen fans and the film critics on the Net. Now for the persuading part. Could some of you share why you liked the book and/or film so much?
Persuasion is going to premiere on PBS this season so for those of you who want a copy - watch for it!
Natalie
Posted by Laura on September 16, 1996 at 15:17:42:
Is this a weird name or common name? Also, don't you just love how this movie ends. I love the scene in Florence with the other Miss Lucy and Miss Charlotte and the Miss Alans, and Mr Beebe.
Follow Ups:
Posted by Linda on September 16, 1996 at 15:19:55:
: : : : Sarah
: : : : I can't remember if we have talked about this before - when did Darcy ever hear Lizzie play and sing prior to the mini concert at Rosings? Col Fitzwilliam greets her at their first meeting at the Collins with "I understand you sing AND play" - how did he know? Was it just heresay like when Caroline "duck face" Bingley tells Darcy in the scene after dinner at Pemberly something about how they had heard of Lizzie's beauty before they arrived.
:
: : : Amy
: : : Many more meetings between the Bingleys/Darcy and the Bennets were either described or implied in the book. At least one dinner, for example, was not shown, but was obliquely referred to when Lizzie told Jane she bet Bingley would be back and dining at Longbourn within a fortnight.
: : Johanna
: : No, that dinner was speculation on Elizabeth's part, assuming Bingley's love for Jane would overcome any machinations that his sisters may have to break off his attentions. So, there was nothing in the book (or show) left out, because that dinner never, in fact took place, Jane received further news that the Bingleys would stay on in London with no plans to return, thus curtailing the dinner Elizabeth had anticipated. I really can't recall any circumstance in which Darcy would have heard Elizabeth play prior to Rosings.
: The time it would most likely have taken place would have been while Jane was sick at Netherfield - in the book they stay several more days than in the film and Lizzie endurees several more uncomfortable evenings in the society of Darcy and the Bingley sisters, but it could have been just hearsay, too, since someone ("duck face" after raving about Georgiana's accomplishments?) did ask her whether she played and sang, and she replied that she did, but very ill.
: But the film's script and/or continuity person appear to have been confused about this, too, since after Lizzie and the Gardiners leave Pemberly following the scene in which Lizzie does sing and play, Caroline carries on criticising Lizzie at length and says (incorrectly) that she does recall Darcy "one evening after they's been dining at Netherfield, saying 'She a beauty? I'd as soon call her mother a wit'". Well, that conversation actually took place after they had attended the Assembly in Meryton, not after they had dined at Netherfield, so it appears that there is some impression that they had had the Bennets to dinner at some time, and that the Bennets had plans to reciprocate when the Netherfield party suddenly left for London.
: Joan, too
Follow Ups:
Posted by Linda on September 16, 1996 at 15:23:09:
: Actually, in the book Lizzie (chapter 6) did play and sing in front of Darcy, although we are not told what Darcy's reaction is.
This was at Sir William Lucas' party, shortly before Lizzie refused to dance with Darcy.
: : : : : Sarah
: : : : : I can't remember if we have talked about this before - when did Darcy ever hear Lizzie play and sing prior to the mini concert at Rosings? Col Fitzwilliam greets her at their first meeting at the Collins with "I understand you sing AND play" - how did he know? Was it just heresay like when Caroline "duck face" Bingley tells Darcy in the scene after dinner at Pemberly something about how they had heard of Lizzie's beauty before they arrived.
: :
: : : : Amy
: : : : Many more meetings between the Bingleys/Darcy and the Bennets were either described or implied in the book. At least one dinner, for example, was not shown, but was obliquely referred to when Lizzie told Jane she bet Bingley would be back and dining at Longbourn within a fortnight.
: : : Johanna
: : : No, that dinner was speculation on Elizabeth's part, assuming Bingley's love for Jane would overcome any machinations that his sisters may have to break off his attentions. So, there was nothing in the book (or show) left out, because that dinner never, in fact took place, Jane received further news that the Bingleys would stay on in London with no plans to return, thus curtailing the dinner Elizabeth had anticipated. I really can't recall any circumstance in which Darcy would have heard Elizabeth play prior to Rosings.
: : The time it would most likely have taken place would have been while Jane was sick at Netherfield - in the book they stay several more days than in the film and Lizzie endurees several more uncomfortable evenings in the society of Darcy and the Bingley sisters, but it could have been just hearsay, too, since someone ("duck face" after raving about Georgiana's accomplishments?) did ask her whether she played and sang, and she replied that she did, but very ill.
: : But the film's script and/or continuity person appear to have been confused about this, too, since after Lizzie and the Gardiners leave Pemberly following the scene in which Lizzie does sing and play, Caroline carries on criticising Lizzie at length and says (incorrectly) that she does recall Darcy "one evening after they's been dining at Netherfield, saying 'She a beauty? I'd as soon call her mother a wit'". Well, that conversation actually took place after they had attended the Assembly in Meryton, not after they had dined at Netherfield, so it appears that there is some impression that they had had the Bennets to dinner at some time, and that the Bennets had plans to reciprocate when the Netherfield party suddenly left for London.
: : Joan, too
Posted by eva on September 16, 1996 at 17:22:32:
: : Are we ready to start? Maybe to ease into it, we could first tell about our experience with the film: saw it before? read the book? read any Forster?
: : Amy
:
: Okay, I'll tell you when I first saw ARWAV. It was about 4 months ago. I have really been into the period English movies and was clamoring for something in which I could sink my teeth into. Well people mentioned ARWAV, and Rupert was in it. So I relented and rented. I absolutely fell in love with that whole genre. I do remember a couple of years back trying to watch "Howard's End" but I kept falling asleep. Anyway, I'm not a huge Julian Sands fan, he comes across as too Aryan for me. But I always admired Maggie Smith and Helena Bonham-Carter because she is so beautiful. I have not read the book. I think I'm intimidated by Forster. Hey I just finished all of Austen's novels I can only do one author at a time. Well I'm now up to Dickens. I have read Bronte. Well Forster is next then ABDF. Get it? so. That is my history of ARWAV. From there I have seen Where Angels Fear to Tread, Maurice (excellent), A Handful of Dust, Howard's End(finally stayed awake and loved it). I have yet to see A Passage
: to India, then I believe I would have seen all the Forster Movies. Sorry long enough post. Laura
Laura, i could have written your post EXACTLY! ...i went through a similar British/drama movies phase and checked out a but of M/I type movies a couple months ago too! ARWAV was a major find! i also felt similarly about Julian Sands (he was weird-creepy in 'Boxing Helena'), but i really like his quirkiness and accent. plus i think you will DEFINITELY be able to handle Forster. he is nowhere near as verbose as our beloved Jane or philosophical and descriptive as Dickens. in fact, i found Forster to be surprisingly succinct and he did not explore characters' feelings and motivations in depth at all (i had to see how faithful the movie ARWAV was to its novel!)... so there is no need to feel this pre-intimidation, you lit-connoisseuse you!
Posted by Raphael Tehan on September 16, 1996 at 19:57:22:
Slightly off the beaten path --
Do any of you have any sorts of production info on the BBC/A&E
version of EMMA set to air next Feb.?
For those questioning the appropriateness of its placement here,
a preview of Emma was given in a little box during the credits
of a recent evening repeat of P&P2 on A&E, including an
especially long edition during the credits of the final episode.
I believe I read somewhere on the internet that Andrew Davies is
the teleplay writer (marvelous!), and thus have a great suspicion
that much of the principal crew from P&P2 returns for this production.
Is that Kate Beckinsale in the lead?
Thanks much, and I'm ever so glad there's a clinic for us addicts.
It sort of makes up for the fact that warning labels were not given
prior to P&P2's airing.
Raphael Tehan
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