How do we know that Mr Collins is not

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How do we know that Mr Collins is not Written by kathleen (elder) (4/21/2010 7:21 p.m.) in consequence of the missive, I agree with that view. Why leave a friendship of long, penned by AnnetteJ

abusive? Or why is there a strong doubt of it being possible? I have read this argument from other posters, and I wonder how they can possibly know -- in real life people outside the abused family rarely know that someone is abusing a spouse, etc.

BTW, I am not trying to claim that Mr Collins WILL be an abusive husband, only that there is no knowing for certain either way.

IMO Charlotte is making a mistake, based solely on what we do know about Mr Collins (that he is a pompous fool). I agree w/ Elizabeth's assessment -- and have done so for nearly 50 years. :-)

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Elizabeth "shooting from the hip" over Charlotte.. jeffrey (4/19/2010 1:08 p.m.)

Engaged to Mr. Collins! my dear Charlotte, impossible! Stephanie (4/19/2010 3:50 p.m.)
- There is a great essay entitled "Sleeping with Mr Collins&qu AnnetteJ (4/19/2010 4:19 p.m.)
  - Eeeyew...perish the mental image of THAT! (NFM) jeffrey (4/19/2010 4:35 p.m.)
    - similarities between Sir William and Mr. Collins Carol (4/26/2010 3:44 p.m.)
      - Never thought of that before. Thanks. nfm BarbaraB (4/27/2010 2:09 p.m.)
      - Similarities & Differences Robbin (4/27/2010 6:51 p.m.)
  - Great point OlgaI (4/21/2010 4:40 a.m.)
    - My image of Mr Collins is based entirely on kathleen (elder) (4/21/2010 7:09 p.m.)
      - I was talking of another take but   OlgaI (4/22/2010 4:20 a.m.)
        
        I agree that Charlotte can probably   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 6:22 a.m.)
        
        Charlotte's future   OlgaI (4/22/2010 7:38 a.m.)
        
        From near-certain misery to...   gianni (4/22/2010 9:37 a.m.)
        
        Living w/ her family is near-certain misery?   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 10:12 a.m.)
        
        Because she is not a child any more   OlgaI (4/22/2010 11:21 a.m.)
        
        So JA should have married?   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 11:34 a.m.)
        
        Yes if she would have liked   OlgaI (4/22/2010 11:52 a.m.)
        
        So, do you believe that JA chose   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 12:11 p.m.)
        
        Don't you please use JA   OlgaI (4/22/2010 12:19 p.m.)
        
        I do NOT judge her by myself :-)   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 12:21 p.m.)
        
        Exactly!   OlgaI (4/22/2010 12:23 p.m.)
        
        My five cents   Nina RG (4/22/2010 12:03 p.m.)
        
        Obviously Charlotte would rather marry than not   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 12:06 p.m.)
        
        Happiness in marriage is entirely a matter of chance   Nina RG (4/22/2010 12:12 p.m.)
        
        LOL -- according to the unmarried Charlotte, yes! nfm   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 12:22 p.m.)
        
        It would have been interesting   Karen G (4/22/2010 1:10 p.m.)
        
        Perfect for Each Other   Robbin (4/23/2010 1:29 p.m.)
        
        Interesting comparison Charlotte to Mr. Bennet   Karen G (4/23/2010 1:45 p.m.)
        
        An Exemption   Robbin (4/23/2010 2:02 p.m.)
        
        I think this is a modern, Western attitude   Connie (4/22/2010 12:26 p.m.)
        
        I don't think so   OlgaI (4/22/2010 2:21 p.m.)
        
        I agree   Line (4/22/2010 9:50 a.m.)
        
        Security and happiness...   Connie (4/22/2010 10:18 a.m.)
        
        Unintelligent by nature or nurture?   Adrian (4/22/2010 12:59 p.m.)
        
        The terms of the entail are   kathleen (elder) (4/22/2010 2:11 p.m.)
- Elizabeth, in an off-handed way, showing concern for.. jeffrey (4/19/2010 4:28 p.m.)
- Her initial reaction CarolTS (4/19/2010 4:43 p.m.)
Dissapointment and age B. Michelle (4/19/2010 6:50 p.m.)
- Not quite the same boat CarolTS (4/19/2010 10:08 p.m.)
  - Do we drop our friends because they do something AnnetteJ (4/20/2010 8:27 a.m.)
    - Lizzy's loss of closeness to Charlotte... Adrian (4/20/2010 12:35 p.m.)
      - Is that because of whom Charlotte married or Lizzy's view   AnnetteJ (4/20/2010 12:58 p.m.)
        
        How about love, marriage hopes for Lizzy? nfm   Connie (4/20/2010 2:40 p.m.)
        
        Not sure why that would be a problem. nfm   AnnetteJ (4/20/2010 4:26 p.m.)
        
        Well, if you were Lizzy...   Connie (4/20/2010 4:47 p.m.)
        
        sensible, intelligent young woman [] readily joined by Jane   Stephanie (4/20/2010 9:00 p.m.)
        
        I agree with that view. Why leave a friendship of long   AnnetteJ (4/21/2010 8:18 a.m.)
        
        Too early in the AM: "Any danger of that" nfm   AnnetteJ (4/21/2010 8:20 a.m.)
        
        nor could Elizabeth persuade [Jane] to consider it as improbable   Stephanie (4/21/2010 11:35 a.m.)
        
        How do we know that Mr Collins is not   kathleen (elder) (4/21/2010 7:21 p.m.)
        
        I think "romanticized" is the wrong adj. for Jane.   Connie (4/21/2010 10:51 a.m.)
        
        I'm not so sure   Nancy Ann (4/24/2010 11:41 a.m.)
        
        I did not mean to say that advice was the only reason...   Connie (4/24/2010 3:40 p.m.)
        
        I still hope that Lizzy   Nancy Ann (4/25/2010 9:43 a.m.)
        
        I imagine that if Lizzy can be civil to Darcy...   Adrian (4/25/2010 9:09 p.m.)
- Never really knew Charlotte Barbara (4/20/2010 12:28 p.m.)
  - That Lizzy shoul dbe shocked at Charlotte's... Adrian (4/20/2010 12:45 p.m.)
    - Missing all the signs Barbara (4/20/2010 12:59 p.m.)
      - And I would agree with you...   Adrian (4/20/2010 1:04 p.m.)
        
        Maybe Lizzy isn't as good a judge of character as she thinks-nfm   LisaS (4/20/2010 6:53 p.m.)
        
        How often has she been wrong?   Kathi (4/20/2010 9:11 p.m.)
      - Not taking the signs seriously Kathi (4/20/2010 7:55 p.m.)
Consider that... gianni (4/19/2010 8:01 p.m.)
- Austen believed in marrying one's equal. Connie (4/19/2010 8:50 p.m.)
  - the business of love-making relieved them Stephanie (4/19/2010 9:39 p.m.)
  - Ok, so I haven't yet read... gianni (4/19/2010 10:53 p.m.)
    - I think the romantic ideals she criticizes in S&S... Connie (4/20/2010 10:49 a.m.)
      - I have an issue with just one of the statements here.....   jeffrey (4/20/2010 12:33 p.m.)
        
        I agree Jeffrey - Charlotte is no dummy and she could   AnnetteJ (4/20/2010 12:54 p.m.)
        
        I fancy she was wanted about the mince-pies.   Stephanie (4/20/2010 2:14 p.m.)
        
        Charlotte: I am not romantic, you know   OlgaI (4/21/2010 4:24 a.m.)
        
        LOL!   Cheryl (4/21/2010 10:57 a.m.)
        
        You're welcome :)   OlgaI (4/21/2010 2:43 p.m.)
        
        You know, ...   gianni (4/21/2010 11:21 p.m.)
        
        plus Jane   OlgaI (4/22/2010 7:51 a.m.)
        
        The eternal question   Line (4/22/2010 9:36 a.m.)
        
        Uneasy about their friendship?   Line (4/22/2010 9:45 a.m.)
        
        I've never been bothered by that   Karen G (4/22/2010 10:54 a.m.)
        
        Stupid or just socially immature and ignorant? (nfm)   jeffrey (4/21/2010 11:59 a.m.)
        
        Unfortunately both :)   OlgaI (4/21/2010 2:26 p.m.)
        
        I think Charlotte would do her duty by Mr. Collins   Connie (4/20/2010 2:26 p.m.)
        
        Charlotte's feelings for Mr. Collins   Anne-Marie (4/20/2010 2:36 p.m.)
      - Valid or invalid objections to a marriage partner   Barbara (4/20/2010 12:43 p.m.)
        
        We need to distinguish   Adrian (4/20/2010 12:53 p.m.)
        
        My point   Barbara (4/20/2010 1:05 p.m.)
        
        A very good concise point, Adrian...   jeffrey (4/20/2010 1:15 p.m.)
        
        Please add nfm if there is no further message :-) (nfm)   Line (4/20/2010 2:53 p.m.)
        
        Thanks, I forgot (senior moment) (NFM)   jeffrey (4/21/2010 8:23 a.m.)
      - Well, no... gianni (4/20/2010 1:21 p.m.)
        
        Let's stay on topic Cheryl (4/20/2010 2:00 p.m.)
  - JA's own feelings about love and marriage Line (4/20/2010 10:02 a.m.)
Mr Collins, Charlotte, and Lizzy Mary Anne (4/20/2010 8:17 a.m.)
- Elegant females refusing Barbara (4/20/2010 12:08 p.m.)
- Just because you refused him did you think.... Silvia A (4/20/2010 8:26 p.m.)
  - marriage had always been her object; Stephanie (4/20/2010 8:53 p.m.)
    - Precisely what's horrid about it Mary Anne (4/21/2010 8:35 a.m.)
      - Charlotte's margarita! Kathryn Ann (4/23/2010 10:54 a.m.)
  - I agree - a block or defense mechanism Karen G (4/22/2010 1:44 p.m.)
Apologies for introducing this topic ahead of schedule.. jeffrey (4/20/2010 1:33 p.m.)
- We're allowed to talk about all of ch. 13-23 CarolTS (4/20/2010 2:32 p.m.)
  - Who moderates so I can respond accordingly? jeffrey (4/20/2010 5:25 p.m.)
    - Schedule Cheryl (4/20/2010 6:52 p.m.)
      - Put the Chapters on Your Calendar Lenora (4/22/2010 5:48 p.m.)
Charlotte, no guiding hand for Mr Collins, but for their children Benedicte (4/21/2010 5:55 a.m.)
- everything was settled between them to the satisfaction of both Stephanie (4/21/2010 11:24 a.m.)
  - But he's not always going to be under CarolTS (4/21/2010 12:10 p.m.)
    - Escape (perhaps) is not his plan Robbin (4/21/2010 4:11 p.m.)
      - IIRC A living is a life tenure Adrian (4/21/2010 6:03 p.m.)
        
        Thanks Adrian! (:D) nfm Robbin (4/21/2010 7:28 p.m.)
The plight of unmarried women... Benedicte (4/22/2010 2:52 p.m.)
Charlotte vs Lizzy Connie (4/22/2010 4:21 p.m.)
- Charlotte's financial situation Line (4/22/2010 5:48 p.m.)
  - Interesting take on it. Connie (4/22/2010 6:02 p.m.)
- Charlotte marries for security Aaron (4/23/2010 4:04 p.m.)
  - I agree with your post as far as it goes. Connie (4/23/2010 5:25 p.m.)
  - Women had to marry? kathleen (elder) (4/23/2010 8:06 p.m.)
    - turning down her own engagement Aaron (4/27/2010 1:48 a.m.)
      - Spot On! Lenora (4/27/2010 7:54 a.m.)
probably a very big family... Benedicte (4/22/2010 6:19 p.m.)

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